Bill Ross aka Wounded Ego

>>>...I could see your point if there were really good arguments against the Bible's veracity...

Hi, Jim. I agree that *bad* arguments against the Bible's veracity abound. I am probably a disappointment to some on this very blog because I am quick to point out a weak argument, and quick to side with a good one, even if it is not in keeping with the declared purpose of this list (http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com).

Obviously, there are so many assertions made in the Bible, such as the alleged resurrection of Jesus, which it is difficult to prove one way or another because of the inaccessibility of the alleged witnesses and the resurrected Jesus.

Also, many of the arguments made against the Bible are very petty, and many are just wrong!

But for me, the one discovery that more than anything else laid bare the very human and primitive nature of the Bible was its complete ignorance in the matter of cosmology. Its story is played out in a world that is completely different from the real world. We have the Biblical description, we have the telescopes and there is no match.

I'm referring to the following Biblical view of the world:

* the sky ceiling

Gen 1:
6  And God said, Let there be a firmament [rigid structure] in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from

the waters.
7  And God made the firmament [rigid structure], and divided the waters which were under the firmament [rigid structure] from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

I understand why "Moses" might imagine that there was a ceiling holding waters above the dry land. I understand why pre-scientific people might accept this view. Why not? The sky is blue, so it certainly looks like water. It rains, snows and hails, so obviously there is water up there. And to support water, you need a solid structure. You just need "windows" (they didn't have glass - windows were just portals). It really seemed to fit the data that they had back then.

Further, Moses thought that God was a manlike deity who lived in a similar civilization to the one he was familiar with, just above the sky ceiling. This is why repeatedly the prophets would see the heavens open and see God in his throne room, accompanied by messengers who regularly came down to the land to gather intel and report to the great king. Or, they would be dispatched to come to the land to bring messages from the great king. These messengers were God's sons, and they, like God, were men as well. In fact, some abandoned their sky home to come to the land and live the American dream.

Is this just a shortcoming in the Genesis account? No, it is a false view of the world that persists on every page of the Bible. Here is an obvious example from Revelation:

Re 4:1  After this I looked, and, behold, a door [a hatch] was opened in heaven [the rigid sky ceiling]: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Re 11:12  And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

Note that "heaven" just means "sky." If you look at Christian art through the centuries you will see that this was clearly how it was understood. But with the invention of the telescope, it has been redescribed as a place that exists in the "spirit dimension." This appeal to dualism is clearly a dodge. The obvious fact is that the telescope revealed that the cosmology of the Church was wrong.

Note that one does not "switch dimensions" to get to "a spiritual heaven" but rather one travels, rocket like, to the sky:

Acts 1:
9  And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10  And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11  Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

So, to my mind, this is "a good argument against the veracity of the Bible." It is clearly not written by a God who had any inkling about the immensity of space, or that we are on the side of a spinning ball. It was written by pre-scientific men who were ignorant of things we now know by direct observation. They believed and spoke of matters in the Bible **which we do not need to go back in time to confidently falsify**.

I can produce reams of scriptures that echo this error if you need them.

I cover this and other "Shockers" in my book, "Bible Shockers!" http://bibleshockers.com

Bill Ross